"Rapture" or harvest?

[upperworld]

Moved Thread

Just from an imagery point of view it does sound more like a harvest. Kind like leaving us for a few thousand years until our population gets big enough for a nice large meal. Like we do with the animals we eat. Though i don't believe it is a harvest of any kind, now that i'm thinking about it i really hope it doesn't happen while i'm alive on the off chance i'm wrong! (which i usually am)

[Ace Rimmer]

All the theories and senarios floating around now, if, and I repeat if, something does happen, and if we are offered a ride off the planet, I am not taking the first bus, I am going to hang around and see what's going on, if I have a choice.

It's an iffy proposition isn't it.

[Majeston]

Perhaps a celestial parable might clarify this problem of rapture or harvest.........




The next day Jesus again taught the people from the boat, saying: "The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field; but while he slept, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat and hastened away. And so when the young blades sprang up and later were about to bring forth fruit, there appeared also the weeds. Then the servants of this householder came and said to him: 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? Whence then come these weeds?' And he replied to his servants, 'An enemy has done this.' The servants then asked their master, 'Would you have us go out and pluck up these weeds?' But he answered them and said: 'No, lest while you are gathering them up, you uproot the wheat also. Rather let them both grow together until the time of the harvest, when I will say to the reapers, Gather up first the weeds and bind them in bundles to burn and then gather up the wheat to be stored in my barn.'"


and, from anther point of view............


"A sower went forth to sow, and it came to pass as he sowed that some seed fell by the wayside to be trodden underfoot and devoured by the birds of heaven. Other seed fell upon the rocky places where there was little earth, and immediately it sprang up because there was no depth to the soil, but as soon as the sun shone, it withered because it had no root whereby to secure moisture. Other seed fell among the thorns, and as the thorns grew up, it was choked so that it yielded no grain. Still other seed fell upon good ground and, growing, yielded, some thirtyfold, some sixtyfold, and some a hundredfold." And when he had finished speaking this parable, he said to the multitude, "He who has ears to hear, let him hear."


.


.

[Fetapro]

Thought on the Rapture:
I see two possible events.
If and stress the word if, the Rapture is the event where Christ opens a door in heaven and calls the redeemed of the period from the Pentecost to that date then several things will happen. (Christ will not come to the earth during this event, he will open a doorway between the earth and heaven and lift up those who will be with him forever) The first thing that will happen is that the bodies of all these people will be taken up from whatever grave they are resting in. The souls of the persons who occupied those bodies here on earth, will be joined together in heaven. Second those who are living at that time will be changed or translated if you like. All of these persons will not have a choice in the matter they will be taken up no matter what they want. (Sorry but that is just the way it is. This matter is like snow falling, one may like it or hate it but it falls just the same). In both cases these persons will be given new bodies that will have much different attributes than what they have now. They will be able to travel across great distances in less than a second. They will not have to breath air, they will not have to eat (they can eat if they wish, as much as they want without gaining weight). They can exist in several places at once. (Also don't worry about the atoms of one person being used by another. God has accounted for all of the atoms of every person who has ever lived and has the situation under control.)
Second
If the event is a counterfeit, no matter who is responsible for the event, then those taken up will face an uncertain future. Metaluna is correct in the position that if this happens then don't take the first bus. Wait and see what happens.

[Serene]

Wow, I like the part about eating as much as I want without gaining weight.......

[Majeston]

Fetapro my good friend, you have a good heart, but sometimes the spirit is willing but the instrument just isn't able to play the notes.
Let me help you with a little tune-up.

Thought on the Rapture:
I see two possible events.
only two ? LOL
If and stress the word if, the Rapture is the event where Christ opens a door in heaven and calls the redeemed of the period from the Pentecost to that date then several things will happen. It's called a dispensational resurrection, the end of one age and the beginning of another(Christ will not come to the earth during this event,somebody usually does he will open a doorway between the earth and heaven and lift up those who will be with him forever) It's a bit more complicated than thatThe first thing that will happen is that the bodies of all these people will be taken up from whatever grave they are resting in.No, sorry, the bodies have nothing to do with it-"dust to dust" The souls of the persons who occupied those bodies here on earth, will be joined together in heaven.you're jumping wayyyy ahead, after you awake the first resurrection the only thing you have gained is the awakening, no instant transformation into a perfect perfected being, you still have a lot of work ahead of you and an infinitely long journey ahead, more than you can ever imagine Second those who are living at that time will be changed or translated if you like. All of these persons will not have a choice in the matter they will be taken up no matter what they want. you always have a choice- free will is given from God and even He does not abrogate the free-will mandate, it is supreme(Sorry but that is just the way it is. This matter is like snow falling, one may like it or hate it but it falls just the same). In both cases these persons will be given new bodies that will have much different attributes than what they have now. correctThey will be able to travel across great distances in less than a second.sorry, false They will not have to breath air, they will not have to eat (they can eat if they wish, as much as they want without gaining weight).you've been watching too much weight-watcher propaganda They can exist in several places at once.sorry, no (Also don't worry about the atoms of one person being used by another. God has accounted for all of the atoms of every person who has ever lived and has the situation under control.)absolutely
Second
If the event is a counterfeit,don't worry, it won't be no matter who is responsible for the event, then those taken up will face an uncertain future. Metaluna is correct in the position that if this happens then don't take the first bus. Wait and see what happens.

there won't be another bus, take the first one

[paland]

Majeston, you come across as a cult member who is just infatuated with your leader. Your beliefs are yours and I won't critisize them too much, however they are juvenile in scope compared to others beliefs. You should stop talking as if yours and yours only are the beliefs with the all knowing truth. Most cults hold their beliefs as the only true one, despited there being about 250 different cultish beliefs out there. And there are several people on this board who have already gone through your cult and have thought it through and called them out on their BS and decided to leave it. These people are the most spiritual advance around here.

To anyone who has spent a lifetime learning, we constantly run into dogmatic people who feel that it is important for them to force thier beliefs onto others. And many times, they use a book written by bronze-aged, goat molesters on psychedelics. Not a good source to use unless you believe in invisible, magic men who like to kill those who will not bow to their will. Some of us like to see evidence or at least, good reasoning and not ancient scare tactics to come to our conclusions.

So please stop the act of religous know-it-all who is here to save eveyone. Every forum board has these. This board just had a person named "Puma Punka" who talked like he was an ambassador to the aliens and was going to show all of us this ancient wisdom. He got caught with the BS meter too. Most people here are here to learn about newer discoveries about our history, discoveries that involve AA and are ignored by the MSM.

I dont mean to offend in any way, but your schtick gets old when it is the same ole condesending attitute.

[3d monkey]

"The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field; but while he slept, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat and hastened away. And so when the young blades sprang up and later were about to bring forth fruit, there appeared also the weeds. Then the servants of this householder came and said to him: 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? Whence then come these weeds?' And he replied to his servants, 'An enemy has done this.' The servants then asked their master, 'Would you have us go out and pluck up these weeds?' But he answered them and said: 'No, lest while you are gathering them up, you uproot the wheat also. Rather let them both grow together until the time of the harvest, when I will say to the reapers, Gather up first the weeds and bind them in bundles to burn and then gather up the wheat to be stored in my barn.'" "Other seed fell among the thorns, and as the thorns grew up, it was choked so that it yielded no grain."

What the hell made Jeezus speak so?

[upperworld]

Ok let me just interject here for a moment and make sure we keep this thread on the straight and narrow. Majeston is entitled to an opinion like any other member here on this forum, so try and keep the criticisms civil and respectful. In addition Majeston, though i appreciate the opposing viewpoints and different perspectives that you bring to the table, please try and present them as your own opinions and thoughts as opposed to facts that you "know" and are telling all of us. Ok proceed with gentlemanly discussion

[Majeston]

"The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field; but while he slept, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat and hastened away. And so when the young blades sprang up and later were about to bring forth fruit, there appeared also the weeds. Then the servants of this householder came and said to him: 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? Whence then come these weeds?' And he replied to his servants, 'An enemy has done this.' The servants then asked their master, 'Would you have us go out and pluck up these weeds?' But he answered them and said: 'No, lest while you are gathering them up, you uproot the wheat also. Rather let them both grow together until the time of the harvest, when I will say to the reapers, Gather up first the weeds and bind them in bundles to burn and then gather up the wheat to be stored in my barn.'"

"

What the hell made Jeezus speak so?

LOL He probably read paland's post

[Tootsie]

This is my first posting. I’ve been reading this extremely interesting forum for a couple of months and have all my life had similar thoughts and questions. I’ve also fairly recently had a profound shift in my belief in the religious dogma I was taught and forced to believe under the threat of hell. I faced my lurking doubts with my reason. I’ve certainly wondered about the rapture being a harvest. The golden city described in Revelation is frighteningly similar to the Borg ship in Star Trek Next Gen. Gene Roddenberry was a genius and a visionary and I think his depiction of the Borg ship could likely have been a reflection of his I think obvious disdain for the bible/religion in general. As I said, he definitely WAS a genius and a visionary. If/when we are raptured/harvested, I believe it could be for a purpose other than just as a benevolent action on the part of Jesus and his peers to lift the “good” ones out of this mortal human misery; something will be required of us.

[Fetapro]

I have been away for a while. Sorry I have been working on necessary issues. I would have like to spent more time here but, one must do what one must do.
Now in looking at the post about the wheat and the weeds (or tares) and the gathering thereof. My sources show that this describes some of the event that occur at the end of the current age. The wheat are those who will be taken to heaven, the weeds are those who will be burned in the lake of fire. Christ will judge who ends up where. (This is his position), I am presenting it for information purposes. If you disagree with him you are free to take the matter up with him. I am very happy that I am not required to judge anyone.
Tootsie: I have just finished looking at Revelations, and your description is very good. My sources show that at the end of the Great Tribulation Period that the "New Jerusalem" will descend from heaven and take up a position near the earth. The sources state that the "church" will live there in the "New Jerusalem" for at least one thousand years. The sources describe it as a sphere about 15 miles in dia. It should look similar to the moon in today' world.
Time will tell. We will have to watch and see what happens. Observation is a good yard stick to measure any matter with.

[Serene]

You know, I'm kind of over my fears of how I am going to die....car accident...airplane....heart attack....alien harvest....it's going to happen anyway...so I'm at peace with it because I know that it's just my physical body.....although I WOULD be pretty pissed if it happened any time soon.....I still have a lot of plans....

[Ace Rimmer]

You know, I'm kind of over my fears of how I am going to die....car accident...airplane....heart attack....alien harvest....it's going to happen anyway...so I'm at peace with it because I know that it's just my physical body.....although I WOULD be pretty pissed if it happened any time soon.....I still have a lot of plans....

Sums up my feelings as well.
I'm getting older, well only 59, but I'd like a couple more decades, thank you very much.

[greekben]

If it's indeed going to be a "harvest", I'll be the first in line trust me!

[Bob137]

Personally any type of being that would take a few, and kill the rest is not a God of any kind that I want to believe in. For that matter, any kind of being that is of a material nature, is not a God either, but an alien, who are masquerading as Gods. For any kind of being to take the spirits of dead people, (just the ones that believe in it), and then just take the believers of it, and kill the rest, is not a good being to be siding with, but seems to me to have an evil intent, whatever the motivation or intention is, it is still not right or good, and definitely not malevolent in my belief. I would understand beings of an advanced race assisting those who want help away from disaster, but that is much different than actually setting the rest on fire, because they do not see your way of thinking!

[seeker1117]

What Bob said, pretty much.

I've spent a lifetime (52 now) sifting through the BS of religion and its adherents (realized at the tender age of 6, as I was being spiritually raped by the Southern Baptist Church, that what they were shoving down my throat couldn't possibly be right) and also the BS of those who claim to be "in contact with The Aliens" and want to "prepare us for when The Pleiadeans come to take us home", etc...easy to get caught up in all that mess, if one is desperate for a "WHY" for "the way things are".

First and foremost, I have come to feel that ALL religions, yes, even the Pagan ones, from the beginning of time, are ALL just control devices used by those who wish for power over others, to keep "the masses" in line and subserviant. No true good or self-awareness can come from them, and until man is free from them, no true "evolution" can happen. The cynical side of me wishes mightily for a true "Rapture" so that we can finally be free of the religious nutbags and get on with things. One of my favorite quotes of all time comes from that Frenchman from the Age of Enlightenment, Diderot. He said: "Man will never truly be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest."

Lately I've been feeling that if you look at the world long enough without the straightjacket of a religious dogma or the (equally binding) straightjacket of so called "rigid science", it seems to come down to something close to what those "quantum physics is nearly eastern mysticism" guys or the "we're all in a holodeck/computer simulation" types propose, that it's actually US doing all this mess: WE create (or, as some put it, "co-create") this reality with our thoughts, individual and collective. What you give your main attention to is what manifests. Our "collective" reality is the sad state of mass-hypnosis that we all "agree" to in order to construct this "reality". Wonder what might be able to happen if we all agreed to "stop agreeing", eh?

[Bob137]

Hey, I agree to disagree to agree, or something like that. Anyway I think you are on to something, because there are a whole lot of people that are coming to the same conclusions, myself included!

[Ace Rimmer]

I think we're all screwed no matter what you want to call it.

[seeker1117]

I think we're all screwed no matter what you want to call it.

I dunno...I'd like to think there's still a chance for each of us to change the way we look at it all and see past the negativity we're bombarded with "day-in-day-out"...if enough people can do that, maybe the result would be a "critical mass" facilitating that shift in perception that might lead us to a better way of being here...like the New Agers and their "higher planes" of vibration say, but without the dogmatic trappings.

[Bob137]

It would be nice if mankind could just think better, let alone a higher spiritual phase. I think mostly logical, but I also utilize both sides of my brain, and I am empathetic, compassionate, and honest, but most of the people I have met of lately, are still prejudice, ignorant, hateful, rude, and arrogant. It blows me away, that this is the year 2011, it seems more like 1400's sometimes in the way people think! I am still bewildered how many people do not even think of wanting to learn more, or to become better humans, they just think it is okay to be stupid, and go into a rage whenever they feel threatened because someone around them is smart! I think those people need harvesting, of course maybe to some other planet, away from me, (Oh and by the way, these are devout Christians!)!

[seeker1117]

It would be nice if mankind could just think better, let alone a higher spiritual phase. I think mostly logical, but I also utilize both sides of my brain, and I am empathetic, compassionate, and honest, but most of the people I have met of lately, are still prejudice, ignorant, hateful, rude, and arrogant. It blows me away, that this is the year 2011, it seems more like 1400's sometimes in the way people think! I am still bewildered how many people do not even think of wanting to learn more, or to become better humans, they just think it is okay to be stupid, and go into a rage whenever they feel threatened because someone around them is smart! I think those people need harvesting, of course maybe to some other planet, away from me, (Oh and by the way, these are devout Christians!)!

Without a doubt, I believe that "those in power" have waged a war on intelligence, and have, unfortunately, for the most part succeeded. The intentional "dumbing down" of the populace in the last, oh, 30+ years has been one of the most disheartening things to observe (and have to live through)...it started in that decade I call "The Evil 80s", and has amplified (especially since 2000) to a shrillness that's unbearable. It's one of the reasons it's nice to find a place to speak openly about things...I've gotten to the point where I don't really talk to others about anything deeper or more meaningful the weather in my day-to-day dealings. My sweetie and I have a small circle of friends our age that we share things with, and that's about it. All of us agree that it feels as though we "lost a decade"...the "00s"...it feels like we had ten years of our lives ripped from us, without our consent.

[Fetapro]

Two thoughts on this matter. I was researching the Hopi information about the four major events that effected the world. Out of this research came an interesting data point. One group uses web bots to try and predict the future. They say that their process correctly predicted 9-11 and the 2004 earthquake and tsunami in the Indian Ocean. They say that the web bots cannot find any data for the period of 12-22-2012 until about 5-1-2013. They say that the web bots can find data after the May period. To me this indicates that an event of some kind will occur during this period.
Second: Other sources that I have, predict that what ever event occurs it will not be the "Rapture" described in the book of the Revelation.
What ever happens, it will not be the events described in the book of the Revelation. There may be a similarity to those events, but the actual rapture will occur some time in the future beyond 12-22-2012. I think that there is a reasonable probability that the events of late 2012 an early 2013 will deal with "alien beings".
I am searching through all sources of data that I can find to try and establish what will occur, if obtain a reasonable answer I will post it.

[Bob137]

I believe why the web bots probably cannot find any data for that time period, until the next, is that our sun with it's height of solar flares in on 12/2012 to 2013, will knock out all electricity on the planet, (which by the way Astronomers warned the Department of Energy about), for a few years. Also George Washington had a dream to that effect in the future, (which we are now in the future).

[mahalla2]

Spiritual events and religious events are not necessarily the same thing, and so the fact there could be a spiritual event and then a counterfit version is not beyond the realm of belief at least for me. However, to get all negative about anything that is perceived as religious could be a problem too since a lot of people get the terms spiritual and religious confused - I believe there will be a spiritual harvesting of the righteous

[Bob137]

M, I believe that also, that a spiritual event will take place soon, and that an unorthodox event created by mankind, or aliens, may also take place, and that the two are not the same. The spiritual event is more than likely a raising up of consciousness, or a better connection with the Cosmic Consciousness, and possibly a higher vibratory existence, which may actually put us into a higher dimensional vibrational existence, which may actually save us from catastrophies on the earth. The so called religious rapture, will more than likely in my opinion either a mass killing, or a mass harvest of humans taken to another planet, (will probably be of their own free will due to ignorance). This is just my opinion from what I have learned, researched, and experienced in my life. I also think that religion can do some good for many, but the way it is put out to people is through dogmatic control of thought, and belief and is not healthy!

[mahalla2]

M, I believe that also, that a spiritual event will take place soon, and that an unorthodox event created by mankind, or aliens, may also take place, and that the two are not the same. The spiritual event is more than likely a raising up of consciousness, or a better connection with the Cosmic Consciousness, and possibly a higher vibratory existence, which may actually put us into a higher dimensional vibrational existence, which may actually save us from catastrophies on the earth. The so called religious rapture, will more than likely in my opinion either a mass killing, or a mass harvest of humans taken to another planet, (will probably be of their own free will due to ignorance). This is just my opinion from what I have learned, researched, and experienced in my life. I also think that religion can do some good for many, but the way it is put out to people is through dogmatic control of thought, and belief and is not healthy!

Hi Bob - yes, you could possibly be right on all counts , and I dislike the term religion just for some of the same reasons you stated (dogmatic control of thought, belief, plus uncontested control of planetary resources!)

[Bob137]

If the rise of the Holy Roman Catholic Church is the New Jerusalem, then Hell must be a paradise!